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Home arrow newsitems arrow Macron to EF: EUCitizens Consultation before EU Decisions also After 2019 with Real Debates from Now

Macron to EF: EUCitizens Consultation before EU Decisions also After 2019 with Real Debates from Now

Written by ACM
Wednesday, 18 April 2018
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*Saint-Dié/Vosges Mountains/Angelo Marcopolo/- Replying to an "Eurofora" Question, French President Emmanuel Macron made it clear that he Intends to Advance Further than the current "EU Citizens' Consultations", just Launched Yesterday (See: http://www.eurofora.net/newsflashes/news/macronlauncheseucitizenconsultations.html), for the Next 6 Months of 2018, and Help Open a New Era of Revitalized European Democracy in the foreseeable Future, as Logical Part of his Wider Plan for a Stronger "European Sovereignity", in Addition to the National one, in certain Key Areas of Crucial Importance, while also advancing even more closer to "Eurofora"s 1997-(and mainly: 2006)- 2018 Project.

+But, at the Same Time, Macron also Revealed, Today, pursuing his 3 Days-Long March up to the Vosges Mountains' Rural area, near Strasbourg, that he trully Believes to Real Exchanges with concerned Citizens on "Hot" Socio-Political Issues, Before Key Decisions affecting their Lives and/or Society at large, as he Clearly Proved Now on the spot, at Saint-Dié City :

 

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I.e. a small but much needed and Timely "Political Miracle" at the Symbolic HeadQuarters of Vosges' Mountains Historic Christian Community, (by its ArchiBishopric at a Huge Cathedral, main Stop of his Visit),

 

 world_map_with_america_name_for_1st_time_published_at_saintdi_1507_wikipediaeurofora_400

as well as the "International Capital of Geography", proud to have given, for the 1st Time in History, the Name of "America" to the Continent facing Europe at the Other Side of the Atlantic Ocean, (thanks to a Landmark Edition of a World Map and relevant Book Published here as Early as since 1.507 AC). And also a City which had been Razed to the Ground, during Destructive Wars of the Past, its Population being Obliged to stay at the surrounding Forests, But Succeeded, Afterwards, to be Restored and ReVitalized. Almost, mutatis-mutandis, as Europe ?...


Macron Proved that, indeed, by Engaging Long and Hard, but Direct Debates even with several Groups of Initially Hostile Demonstrators, (including, f.ex., Railworkers Striking against a forthcoming Reform, due to introduce also some EU Competition, etc., as well as a Leftist Group of Melanchon's pro-"Resistance" fans Opposed also to Other Socio-Ecoomic Reforms, etc), by Spending several Hours to Speak and Exchange in Dialogue with them, until some Previously Insulting Cries, gave the way to Civilized Arguments, amidst an apparently growing Mutal Respect, (See Infra).


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 - "Hi ! How are things going ?", a Smiling Macron suddenly Emerged in front of "Eurofora", Saluting Familiarly, after a Long Waiting Time, (See Infra).


- "Eurofora" immediately asked President Macron "if he Wished to Continue regular EU Citizens' Consultations (Before key EU Decisions) also in the Future, After 2019", (particularly considering EU Lisbon Treaty's relevant Article 11 which provides for the "Expression" of "Citizens"' Views on EU Activities, and even for "Regular Debates" with "Civil Society" on them : Comp. http://www.eurofora.net/newsflashes/news/euombudsmandecisionandeuroforaproject.html , etc).


 - "Yes ! Certainly !...", Affirmed, Clearly, the French President, in a Positive Reply to the above-mentioned "Eurofora"s Question.


 - "At any case, that's what I Intend to do", Macron carefully Added, (while Walking away Slowly, still Hearing, Thoughtfully, and Looking Behind, as if he wanted also to make sure that everything was OK despite a somewhat rush movement by the Police among the Croud gathered around, apparently not always realizing the Fact that Elysée's Accredited Journalists had been Invited to Accompagny the President's walk through the People gathered at the Central Streets of the City).

 

press_card_elyse_vosges_400 


 - Indeed, that seems Logical in the overall Context of the President's Views, particularly for a More Democratic Europe, carefully but positively Confirmed also to "Eurofora", a Macron-Faithful, now Elysée Palace's Press Attaché, that we had also Questioned Today on this Same, Key point.


 Something which, while naturally Including the 6-Months-Long current Citizens Consultations of April-October 2018, however, Goes also Well Beyond that important 1st Stage, stimulating Hopes to Open a "New Way" for a ReVitalized European Democracy at the foreseeable Future's Horizon.


I.e., an Obviously Natural Development, clearly Emerging from Macron's Landmark Speech of 7 September 2017, at the Symbolic BirthPlace of Democracy in the Historic "Pnyx" Rock, Facing Acropolis, in Athens, already introducing some key Elements of Systematic Citizens' Participation, sometimes going near to Direct Democracy, during a Crucial Period of the Ancient Greek Civilisation, at one of its Best Moments, which Marked All European Culture and well Beyond, (See "Eurofora"s NewsReport at: http://www.eurofora.net/newsflashes/news/macronatthehistoricsourcesofdemocracy.html).


During an Elysée Palace's Press Briefing, re-transmitted "Live" by Tele-Conference also to Strasbourg's invited Journalists, including "Eurofora", at the Eve of Macron's venue to EU Parliament in Strasbourg, (See "Eurofora"s NewsRaport at: http://www.eurofora.net/newsflashes/news/macronineuparliamentaskscitizensdebates.html), it was stressed that, at least the current, EU Citizens' Consultations of 2018, (due to Spread accross almost All EU Member Countries), could be usefully made also via the Internet, on Condition, always to "Restitute" their main Outcome at a Centralized Website, set up for that purpose.


-But, Yesterday (Tuesday) Evening, at the Official Launch of the 1st such "EU Citizens' Consultation" on Europe's Future, at nearby Epinal City, Administrative Capital of the Vosges' Mountains, near Strasbourg, (See "Eurofora"s NewsReport from the spot at : ...), Macron made it Cleaer that, Often, Personal Exchanges in actual, physical "Meetings", can also be Useful, by Adding a Human Dimension, helping a more Sincere Dialogue, (considering also the Fact that at least a Minority of People are Not Yet so Computer/Internet-Litterate as others).


+ More Important : The embattled, young French President, apparently ...Frustrated by a too "Nice" appearance for almost All his Interlocutors in that 1st Debate, (carefully "Prepared" by a Team under the EU Affairs' State Secretary, Mrs Loiseau), suddenly Felt the Need to ... Ask whether 1 "Anti-European" or, at least, "Euro-Sceptic" existed among that Audience, (getting 1 such Reply, by an unconvincing, however, alleged "Dissident" : See http://www.eurofora.net/newsflashes/news/macronlauncheseucitizenconsultations.html).


However, Macron clearly Stressed and Repeated that EU Citizens' Consultations must Include also current Critics or even Opponents of the EU, sometimes also Calling those "Anti-EU" Dissidents to Add ...their Own "Citizens Consultations", in order to use real Logical Arguments, which can be Exchanged in other, various, even indirect Dialogues with All Other People.


=> And, Indeed, he Already gave, this same week, a First concrete Indication, by Chosing to Limit his Speech at EU Parliament's Plenary in Strasbourg, Yesterday (Tuesday) Morning, mainly into Focusing, precisely, on a Brief reminder of the Current Need for EU Citizens' Debates, in view of a Stronger, "Sovereign Europe", to be added to its Member States' National Sovereignities, there where EU's Bigger "Size" may be really Needed in order to be Efficient in nowadays World, while Spending, Most of his Speaking Time, into Discussing with MEPs (often of Different Opinions) on various Topical Issues related to Europe's present and Future, (See: http://www.eurofora.net/newsflashes/news/macronineuparliamentaskscitizensdebates.html ).


>>> But, Today, at Saint-Dié City, this, UnExpectedly, Became a True and "Hard" Reality, also vis a vis Real Socio-Political Dissidents, (sometimes even some among the more Harsh, as f.ex. the "CGT" and/or "SUD" Trade Unions, Leftist Political Demonstrators, etc), litterally "on the Streets", including certain Sudden U-Turns and/or Surprizes, amidst the ambiant Tension of an on-going Railway Nation-Wide Strike, and Rapid Moves of Loudly Shouting Groups of initially very Hostile Dissidents or Political Opponents :


This Transformed what was initially supposed to be just a Friendly Stroll around Central City Streets to Greet the main Shop-Keepers patiently waiting for the French President's visit, in front of the Press and Local Fans, into a ...Real Arena of Hard Political Confrontations in several "Hot", un-foreseen Debates with Dissidents and/or Opponents...

 

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Today, the new French President, Emmanuel Macron, proved in real practice, at  Vosges Mountains' Saint-Dié city, that even Strong Disagreements on Issues of crucial Importance can and must be Democratically Debated, with elementary mutual Respect among initially Opposed parties :

- Indeed, contrary to an unrealistic "Nice, Gendle Mood" ambiant, just Yesterday, at the Official Launch of the 1st among a 6 Months-Long Series of EU Citizens Consultations throughout 27 EU Countries on Europe's foreseeable Future, that Macron inaugurated Tuesday Evening at nearby Epinal City's Congress Center ( See "Eurofora"s NewsReport from the spot at: http://www.eurofora.net/newsflashes/news/macronineuparliamentaskscitizensdebates.html),


this,  subsequent event at Saint-Dié was, in fact, an unforeseen, Harsh Clash and Confrontation in public, at the Street, standing for Hours amidst a crashing Heatwave, between 2 really Opposed Views, on a Hard nut to crack, concerning the current Strikes by Railway Workers against a proposed Reform before EU Competition starts to be applied soon  :

Macron was initially Aggressed, several times, by various Hostile Groups, smaller in number than his fans and simple friendly citizens,  but much more Loud, Negative, and initially grossly Insulting, to an unprecedented level, without any formal Police authorisation to demonstrate so aggressively on that spot...

But, instead of sending the Police to disperse them, or merely Ignoring them by walking towards another street where he was awaited by friendly People, on the Contrary, the young French President bravely decided to go, meet and speak with those Opposed Dissidents, and Start Discussing with them for... Hours  !  

 

macron_speaks_with_melenchons_leftists_at_saintdi_eurofora_400_01


+ This was repeated also with some other Loud Dissident Groups, extending the program for 2 or 3 Hours more, until Angry Cries were progressively Replaced by Hard but Sincere Arguments.


A Young Elysée Palace's Press Officer, Jean Gaborit, who had followed Macron since a Long Time, (Together with his main Collegue, Marion Bayret, often met by "Eurofora" in Brussels' EU Summits, etc), told us that he had Never Seen Before, "at such a Level", a similar event elsewhere...


 And even if there wasn't yet any breakthrough agreement in substance, at least, an obvious mutual Respect was apparently established (even some Applaud was heard sometimes afterwards, around those Dissidents, on certain points) !


"Eurofora" later, (while Departing, Earlier than other Elysée Group of Journalists, for Strasbourg, because of an EU Parliament's meeting to follow Tomorrow Morning/Noon in Strasbourg: See http://www.eurofora.net/newsflashes/news/euonukrainereformsbeforeelection.html), found several Trade Unionists and/or Other Critics in front of the City's Rail-Road Station, and/or aroud it, Ready to Discuss about their various Disagreements with Macron, But also willing to Admit that, at least, a Frank but Honest, Direct Dialogue had been Established, even with the Highest Political Authority of the Country...

 

saint_di_historic_cathedral__near_eurofora_400 


=> In other word, it all seems as if a kind of ... Socio-Political "Miracle" had Started to Emerge, at this Symbolic "Saint-Dié" (means "Holy God") City, full of Simple, Rural People at Vosges' Mountains, whose Historic Saint (pictured at an Impressive, Huge Cathedral, in Front of which the French President concluded his Official Visit), is named "Deodace", i.e. something which obviously Reminds (even if it might not actually mean that) : "Deus" (i.e. God) and "Audacious" !


Macron might, perhaps, not exactly be a Traditional "Religious" man, even if he is a baptised Christian, as the Large Majority of French People. And, at any case, as President of the French Republic, he is notoriously Obliged to be Neutral on Religious affairs, in Principle left for the Civil Society and private life.  


But, anyway, it's a Fact that it all looks as if the current Initiator of EU Citizens' Consultations really is an ..."Audacious" European Political Leader !

 jeanne_d_arc_born_at_saintdis_diocese_wikipediaeurofora_400

It's not for nothing that near the Saint-Dié City, where Macron chose to act as mentioned, was also Born the Famous "Jeanne d' Arc", France's National Hero, (but with Appeal also towards Germany, where the French President is due to meet German Chancelor Angie Merkel Tomorrow, in Berlin)... 

 

(../..)


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They voted to "freeze" UK Government's draft to put People in jail for 42 Days on "anti-terrorist" suspicion without charge, or they abstained. Don't they look suspect ?
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CoE's debate on UK controversy stirs PanEuropean check of anti-terror suspects' imprisonment

Former Leftists of the Sixties would boil in hot water if they heard PACE's debate on the controversial 42 days detention without charge, currently drafted by the British Government :

A "Socialist" Government, a Socialist PACE Rapporteur and a Socialist Chair of PACE's Legal Committee, opposed a .. "Conservative" amendment (supported by .. Liberals, Democrats, etc), to freeze the measure, in order to protect Citizens' Freedom, by "waiting" until CoE's Venice Committee checks its conformity with Human Rights' principles.

"Left"'s support to Conservative-Lib.Dem's criticism, wasn't enough to obtain a majority, nor to make things as they were back in the good old days, when "Left" and "Right" had a clear meaning, as "liberty" and "restrictions"...

Conservatives and most Democrats were joined by the Left in voting for the "freeze", as well as Liberal Paul Rowen, while Socialist MEP Ivan Popescu, an experienced MEP from Ukraine (PACE Member since 1996-2008) abstained. But most Socialists, added to a few Liberals and EPP's Right, voted against.

Fortunately, someone inside PACE had the wise idea to shorten the Debate for less than 1 Hour, and put it on the Agenda only at the end of an exceptionally busy day, towards the end of the Evening, when most MEPs had already gone to taste wins and foods at various Receptions all around Strasbourg's "European" area : As a result, not even 42 MEPs weren't present..

Socialist Lord Tomlinson accused the leaders of the PanEuropean Assembly, in its highest body : the "Bureau", to "lack wisdom" by deciding to hold a Debate on an issue that neither the Socialist Chair of the Legal Committee, nor its Socialist "reluctant Rapporteur", did "not want to do", ...

tomllinson

Finally, everybody (critics and supporters alike) was happy to agree, in substance, that the controversial measure "may" gravely violate Human Rights, and therefore, PACE asked Legal Experts of Venice Commission to check UK Government''s plans.

But this might take more than .. 42 Days to do, since PACE's Rapporteur asked the Experts to enlarge their study in a PanEuropean comparison of all that is happening on "anti-terrorism" legislation in 47 CoE Member Countries, including Russia, Turkey and Azerbaidjan..

Bad lack : "The existing 28 days’ detention without charge in the UK is, in comparison with other CoE member countries, one of the most extreme : In Turkey, the period is 7,5 days, in France 6 days, in Russia 5 days, and in .. the U.S. and Canada just 2 and 1 days respectively", denounced Democrat MEP Ms WOLDSETH from Norway..

woldsteth

"Numerous respected human rights organisations, including Liberty and Human Rights Watch, have expressed serious concern" "The proposed legislation ...could easily lead to extensive abuses. ...Detention for 42 days means six weeks in which one is taken away from one’s family, friends, home and livelihood only to be let off without being charged. That will destroy lives and isolate communities", she added.

- "3 years ago, the UK Government sought to increase the period of pre-charge detention from 14 days to 90 days. Not long before that, it had been only 7 days. There was a vigorous debate ...and a ...compromise was reached of 28 days. We have to ask whether there are proper safeguards in place to extend the period to 42 days. I suggest that there are fatal flaws", reminded British Conservative Clappison.

- "What sort of society holds someone in detention for 42 days and does not have to tell the person who is in prison why they are there, or explain the suspicions that arose and led to their detention? What sort of society believes that that is the way to treat its citizens? That is an appalling injustice, ...A 42-day detention period will not make the UK safer. Instead, it will be the first step to giving in to terrorists; it is saying that we are prepared to sacrifice our democratic rights and the principles for which we have stood for centuries", criticized British Liberal Michael Hanckock

hancock

"Comments made ...by Norwegian delegates are unfortunate", replied British Socialist MEP Ms.Curtis-Thomas, accusing them to "besmirch the reputation of our police force, which is one of the Best in the World", as she said, believing that "there are significant safeguards ...to ensure that individuals are not subjected to unlawful detention"

curtis

PACE "has serious doubts whether ...the draft legislation are in conformity with the ...case-law of the European Court of Human Rights. A lack of ..safeguards may lead to arbitrariness, resulting in breaches of ... liberty and ...right to a fair trial". PACE "is particularly concerned that: ..the judge ..may not be in a position to examine whether there exist reasonable grounds for suspecting that the arrested person has committed an offence;"; that "... representation by a lawyer may be inappropriately restricted or delayed;" that "information on the grounds for suspicion of a person ...may be unduly withheld.. ;" that this "may give rise to arrests without the intention to charge;", and; in general, that "prolonged detention without proper information on the grounds for arrest may constitute inhuman treatment", says Klaus De Vries' Report, adopted with 29 votes against zero.

vries

Records don't say if it took him 42 Days to draft his Report, but, at least, he knew why...

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2009 EU Elections were won by Parties against Technocracy and Turkey's controversial EU bid, while the 1999-2004 Majority Abstention trend decelerated. What should be done in 2009-2014 ?

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