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Αρχική arrow newsitems arrow CFE Council/Commission/Parliament Chairs on EF's Dialogue with Citizens on Acts: Debate or Muzzle ?

CFE Council/Commission/Parliament Chairs on EF's Dialogue with Citizens on Acts: Debate or Muzzle ?

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Saturday, 23 October 2021
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*Strasbourg/EU Parliament/Angelo Marcopolo/- For the 1st Time reacting All Together to EU Citizens' initial Proposals, in the Conference on Europe's Future, the 3 Co-Chairs, Top Representatives of EU Council, Commission and Parliament, (Dovzan, Suica and Verhofstadt), in a Joint Press Conference at EU Parliament in Strasbourg,

Replying to a relevant "Eurofora"s Question on the Eventual Creation of fully-fledged Citizens' new "Right to Dialogue" with EU Decision-Makers, Before Measures Affecting their Lives and/or Society,

=> Welcomed, in Principle, "New Creativity" from EU Citizens, just After Warning for "Intensified" Moves asap, and/or suggested "to Put it into" Public "Debate(s)", in order "To See the Outcome".

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* -Eurofora" observed from the outset: : - "All of you Three, Stressed the Role of Citizens in the EU Decision-Making process : EU Commission's vice-President Suica speaking about an eventual role in the "Drafing" of EU Measures : EU Parliament's Coordinator, Vehofstadt, speaking about a "Permanent" dimension, in one way or another, and the EU Council's President-in-office, Slovenian Minister of European affairs, Dovzan, speaking about "Diversity".

=> But, Do you think that European People could legitimately Dream to join all the 3 points that You evoked, and More, in ordert to Invent a Mechanism of a kind of soft buit real "Dialogue" Between EU Citizens and EU Decision-Makers, Before important Decisions Affecting their Lives and/or Society at large, (naturaly in an Adequate way, Protecting the Efficiency of EU Decision-Making, whenever necessary) ?

Such a Proposal has Already been Registered at the Official Internet Platform of the Conference on Europe's Future on 2021 (Since the Day of CFE's 1st Plenary: http://www.eurofora.net/newsflashes/news/euroforaprojectpublishedateuconference.html , at: https://futureu.europa.eu/processes/Democracy/f/6/proposals/32770 ), and, among others, has been Endorsed Also by a 2 Days-Long Public Conference of Citizens organized by the Euro-Metropole of Strasbourg, (in the framework of French President Macron's "Great Debate" 2019, as well as Included in the relevant Official Report to the French Government : See http://www.eurofora.net/newsflashes/news/euroforaideasendorsedbystrasbourggreatdebate.html, etc), its Key Parts were Backed "also Elsewhere", f.ex. in Two 2021 Resolutions Adopted by EU Parliament (See: http://www.eurofora.net/newsflashes/news/euparliamentoneuroforaproject.html), after CoE's Assembly (See: ..), and Discussed with Many EU or CoE Top Officials, (while it's even known that, according to Philosopher Platon, describing his famous "Socratic Dialogues", it's the Best Instrument for Finding the Truth).... There are Legal Tools, in this direction, in most EU Member States, and some Relevant Elements even in the existing EU "Lisbon" Treaty", we reminded, (See: http://www.eurofora.net/newsflashes/news/euparliamentonombudsmanandeurofora.html, etc, in relation to which We Positively Discussed "Eurofora"s Project with EU Ombudswoman Emily O'Reilly and French President Emmanuel Macron, who Both Encouraged it : http://www.eurofora.net/newsflashes/news/euombudsmanoneurofforaproject.html + http://www.eurofora.net/newsflashes/news/macronforcitizensdebatesalsoafter2019.html, etc.).

Inter alia, "Eurofora" has Also, more or less Discussed that Project with a lot of Key EU or CoE Top Politicians, during Many Years, including, practicaly including All EU Parliament's Presidents, as the current, David Sassoli, etc., both in Brussels and in Strasbourg, (See, f.ex. : http://www.eurofora.net/newsflashes/news/euparliamentpresidentforstrongcitizenvoices.html + http://www.eurofora.net/newsflashes/news/euparliamentoncitizensforeufuture.html).

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**=> EUCouncil President in Office, Slovenian Minister of European affairs, Dovzan's reply, to "Eurofora"'s Question pppeared quite Dynamic, (particularly at its Concluding Suggestion) : 

"I think that EU is a Multi-Level Governance System, at a Local, Regional, National, and Supra-National levels, and in All Levels we have to Invest Efforts.

But in the EU Level, we have also a multiLingual Platform System, that Allows us to Integrate Ideas.

The (EU) Commission also has a practice to Discuss Ideas and the new Legislation proposed, with Stake-Holders and, let's say : Citizens.

But, We (CFE) can also put it on a Debate,  and We shall See what the Final Outcome would be"...

=> There are, Certainly, Ways to Improve the Existing Mechanisms, that we (EU) Already have".

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*** Surprisingly,  EUCommission Vice-President, in charge of Democracy, Suica's reply to "Eurofora" was quite Different:

- "We caN't preempt the Conclusions : As we said, We are Trying to Listen, to See what Citizens Ask from Us".

-"But, Also, as Mr Dovzan said, the EU Commission has Mechanisms, we have like "Citizens' Initiative", or "Have Your Say", different "Public Consultations", (etc),

- "So that "We are in Constant Dialogue with Citizens", she Claimed.

+ "Our MEPs are Also in Dialogue with their Constituents, also National Parliamentarians", etc. So, we have Contacts'.

=> "But, Now, we are Trying to EmPower outselves with the Ideas, the New Creativity of our Citizens. This is something Completely New".

- "But, Let's See What the End of these Deliberations show", (she apparently Reserved her Final appreciation for Later-on).

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But if some had, eventualy, made Sucia claim that "Eurofora"s Project would not bring something realy New for Citizens' Rights, then, such a Misundesrstanding would be a series of Blatant Errors !

- First of all, Obviously, "Have Your Say", and "Citizens' Consultations", are Mere "Consultations", and Not at all a Real "Dialogue" !

F.ex., inter alia, they doN't include at all any EU Citizens' Right to ask a Judge to Control whether EU Commission really Replied to All their legitimate Critical Observations, if it did so Sufficiently, based on Real Facts, and/or Valid Legal Arguments, concerning a Proportionate Measure, aiming to reach a Legal Aim of General Interest, Oherwise Cancelling it, if it did Not. (While, on the Contrary, in accordance with "Eurofora"s published Proposal, An Affected EU Citizen would have been given such a Right to immediately Trigger such a Judicial Control, on any or All of those 7 Points)...

+ As for the UnFortunate "Citizens' Initiative", foreseen by EU's Lisbon Treaty, But Notoriously "Killed", in real Practice, until now, by an Excessively Restrictive and Heavy Reglementation by EU Commission, (initialy endorsed by a Majority in an Old EU Parliament, in the Past), ..

>>> Indeed, those EU Commission's Excessively Heavy PreConditions agains the ECI, had More Bureaucratic Obstacles than ...the Dust from a Big Icelandish Volcano which had Notoriously Downed almost all European Airplanes, by a Coincidence, that Same Day of 2010, (as "Eurofora" Timely and systematicaly had Reminded in All Questions we raised, then, to All Press-Conferences organized by EU Parliament's Political Parties :See ... + http://www.eurofora.net/newsflashes/news/lellouchvolcanoashclouds.html + ... , etc) !

Only an Original, Ground-Braking Cooperation between EU Citizens and MEPs, (practicaly giving to the latter a still Lacking "Legislative Initiative"), as Proposed by "Eurofora" already since 2020, (See: http://www.eurofora.net/newsflashes/news/mepdurandeuroforaonfutureconf.html + http://www.eurofora.net/newsflashes/news/mepdurandeuroforaonfutureconf.html, etc), might Help Bypass the current Deadlock of ECI.

=> The Inevitable Consequence was to Practicaly Undermine that "Citizens' Initiative" tool of Lisbon Treaty, Resulting in a Spectacular Deadlock, Often Denounced by Many People and EU Politicians, until recently, to the poin that such a Scandalous situation made Even the EU Parliament itself to lately Ask on 2021 for a Necessary Change, in order to Make, at last, the ECI more Accessible to real Citizens' concerns in the foreseable Future, (See : http://www.eurofora.net/newsflashes/news/euparliamentoneuroforaproject.html , etc)...

But, Until Now, the Only attempt to Ameliorate, a Little bit, that "Citizens' Initiative"'s Scandalously Restrictive regime, was a Concrete Proposal, (initialy made by "Eurofora"s co-Founder, to EU Parliament's Historic Rapporteur on that issue, French MEP and former EU Affairs Minister, Alain Lamassure, who had Accepted to finaly include it in his Draft Report then), to, at least, let the Authors Participate in a Debate with MEPs inside EU Parliament, (which does Not engage them in Anything, remaining a Simply "Moral" or Symbolic move, withOut Any Legislative or Other Consequence, at least for the Time being)... [See f.ex. Lamassoure's and EU Commissioner Cefcovic's relevant Replies to "Eurofora"s Questions at the Key Press-Conference on ECI's imminent, then, creation, Back on 2010, at : http://www.eurofora.net/newsflashes/news/debatesincitizensinitiatives.html ].

=> Therefore, many converging Crystal-clear and Verifiable Facts prove that, Obviously, Miss Suica's "Experts" on such kind of Issues, Failed her, and MisLed her too much, with False Appearances and Blatant Erroneous and Unsubstantiated Claims about a so-called "pre-existing" EU Citizens' Right of "Dialogue" with EU Decision-Makers Before Decisions affecting their Lives or Society (Comp. Supra), which, in fact, does Not Exist yet...

>>>  Such a Misunderstanding would, indeed, be considered as an illegal act, due to be Cancelled by a Judge, according to "Eurofora"s proposed Legal Mechanism, for at least ... Five (5) Reasons :

 (1)"InSufficient Motivation" : It doesN't take into account the Fact that Individual EU Citizens and Groups of Less than 1 Million (sic !), or Not meeting those Numerous Bureaucratic Conditions imposed by Brussels, (Comp. Supra), do Not have Yet, Nowadays, the Rights that "Eurofora"s Project would give them, for the 1st Time. (In this regard, the Blatant Censorship of "Eurofora"s registered Proposal, at those "Reports" prepared by some Anonymous Bureaucrats Misrepresenting what Really Exists in CoFoE's Web Platform - Contrary to Explicit Links at Many Other, even Caricatural, Hasty claims- speaks for itself for a blatant Discrimination by some, apparently AFraid of Ideas able to Bring Real and Far-Reaching Modern Democratic Changes)...

 (2) "Non-Existent Fact" : Neither "Have your Say", "Consultations", nor "ECI", do Not include EU Institutions' Obligation to give to the Affected Citizens a full and Sufficient Motivation Justifying Why they might Refuse to Stop a planned Measure, by Replying, point by point, to All Citizens' relevant Arguments and Facts, cited in Support of their Opposition, (Contrary to what Suica's above-mentioned Claim obviously implies).

 (3)"Legal Error" : Nothing in "Have Your Say", "Consultations", or "ECI" does Not Give, to each EU Citizen Affected by a planned EU Measure, a Legal Right Equal to that proposed by "Eurofora"s Project, (placed under the Control of a Judge, able to Cancel such an EU Institution's Act, for having followed an Irregular Process of Decision-Making).

 (4) Neither a "Prportionality" Control, Nor for an eventual "Obvious Error of Appreciation", do Not Accompagny Miss Suica's cases of Simple "Consultations", "Have your Say", or "ECI" pre-existing Old Tools, while, on the Contrary, Judges usually Check such Issues in the cases concerned by "Eurofora" Project's Judicial Control of Public Administration Acts... (See, f.ex, "Eurofora" co-Founder's more than 1.000 pages relevant Original Legal Research on Comparative Law, proposed by Strasbourg's Faculty of Law for a Prize awarded to PhD Thesis, after a written proposal by Paris II University Professor Paul Amselek).

 (5) "Detournement de Pouvoir" (French Legal term) : By Falsely Claiming that "Eurofora"s Project would Not Bring Anything really New (sic !), in fact, such a Misconception looks as an Attempt to Muzzle, on the Contrary, a very Far-Reaching Proposal, considerably Strengthening EU Citizens' Democratic Rights in Modern Society...

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>>> At any case, if there might be any kind of Doubt to anyone involved, Why Not Follow the Advise just Given by EU Council's President-in-office, European Affairs Minister Gasper Dovzan, in Conclusion of his Interesting Reply, against any eventual Attempt to Muzzle "Eurofora"'s above-mentioned Query, about the Creation of a brand New EU Citizens' Right to such a "Dialogue": 

- I.e. to Simply Launch a specific EU "Debate" on that Issue, "and See What the Final Outcome would be" (Comp. Supra) ? 

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+ By the way, didn't EU Parliament's Coordinator on CFE, Guy Verhofstadt, just Stress, shortly Earlier, that he Expects for Action around EU Citizens' Proposals, (as Also that of "Eurofora"), to Soon "Intensify", during the Next few Months ?...

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cfe_2nd_plenary_debate_on_citizens_web_platform_ideas_eurofora_400

=> The overall and Sharp Tone of Several "Hot" Interventions, by Various Actors, (Participating Citizens' Ambassadors, MEPs, NGOs, Local-Regional Representatives, Social Partners, etc) during Today's Afternoon 2nd Plenary of the CFE, dealing with Citizens' Ideas at the Web Platform, (i.e. Including that of "Eurofora"s registered Proposal, with More than 750 Followers), gave a Vivid Impression that Many European People really Wished a Change towards such Novel and Modern Democratic Tools, in EU-Citizens relations Nowadays !

 

(../..)

 

("Draft-News")

 

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Former "Green-Red" German government's Foreign Minister Joschka Fischer's job at the controversial Turkish pipeline "Nabucco" was denounced as "not proper", "very bad", and "incompatible with Democracy", by the new President of EU Parliament's EuroLeft Group, German Lothar Bisky, replying to an "EuroFora" question.

For once, criticism of Joschka Fischer's doings with Turkey affecting Europe, didn't come only from the Center-Right of the political spectrum, but even from his Left side : The experienced Bisky, who has been chairing all over 1993-2009 the PDS - Die Linke party :  

- "Former Foreign Minister Joschka Fischer got involved in dealings with oil-gaz business in a foreign country, Turkey, and its controversial Nabucco pipeline. This raises questions about Democracy, also because of the well known problems of Human Rights violations in that country. Do you thing that this might be abused in order to cover up and close EU's eyes on Human Rights violations ?", "EuroFora" asked Bisky.

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- "Nabucco pipeline is (only) at the planning stage". And "there are some difficulties",  he observed from the start. But "'I don't want to get into the details of Nabucco pipeline, because I don't think that there is any point for it at the moment".
 
At any case,  "we  (EU Parliament's EuroLeft Group) strongly believe that Politicians should not get involved in the Energy Business, and all these commercial transactions", President Bisky declared on the Joschka Fiischer's affair.

- "We feel that it's something that shouldn't be done. It's not proper !"           

- "We don't think that it's compatible with Democracy either, and it gets politics into a very Bad track", Bisky went on to denounce.
                                                                                                                                                                        
- "EuroLeft  and "Die Linke" always spoke against that, saying that politicians should not get directly into the arms of private enterprises"

- "It is pretty bad if a former Minister takes a job f.ex. in a major Energy producer. So, it's an issue if a Minister who may have seen excellent opportunities, subsequently gets personally grasp of them, in very serious parts of the economy, once he has given up his (Government) job."

- "It doesn't really make politics in general look any better'", Bisky concluded.

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Earlier, this week in Strasbourg, other Journalists had also raised critical questions on former Foreign Minister Joschka Fischer's involvement in the conroversial Turkish Nabucco pipeline to the President of his own EuroParty : Kohn-Bendit of the "Greens", who, contrary to Bisky, tried to find excuses for Fischer, while criticizing his long-time partner, Schroeder for having done a similar move :

- "Shroeder was chancellor", and he "negociated" with "Russians", who gave him a job only "3 Months" after he resigned from the Government. While "Joschka Fischer", on the contrary, got a job with the controversial Turkish Nabucco pipeline only "4 Years after" he left the Government. "He didn't negociate Nabucco", so I have "no objection", Kohn Bendit claimed.

But, many Facts indicate the contrary :

Joschka Fischer was Foreign Minister in Germany from 1999 up to 2005 : I.e. from the year that EU took the controversial decision to give Turkey a "Candidate" status, until he year it started controversial "accession negotiations, (later declared "open-ended" after Sarkozy-Merkel's arrival from 2005-2007).

During that period was prepared the controversial so-called "Annan" Plan (in fact, drafted by others and attributed afterwards to the former UN SG) on Cyprus, which failed after a Popular Referendum said "No" on 2004 with a large Majoriy of 3/4 : 75%. Mainly because it was criticized for making too much concessions to the Turkish side :  Particularly by restricting Greek Cypriot Refugees' Human Right to return to their ancestral Land and/or get restitution of their Familiy Homes and private properties, usurpated by Ankara's Army since the 1974 militay invasion and continuing occupation of the northern part of Cyprus. And by weakening the Central Government, leaving to 2 "constituent States" so much powers and separate interests that more conflicts appeared inevitable, provoking the danger of a break-down in the foreseable future, with more crisis, troubles, perhaps bloodshed, etc., instead of creating an harmoniously integrated, really one federal State.

The controversial Plan was finalized on March-April 2004 at Burgenstock (Switzerland), curiously in the presence of an Envoy by the Ministry of Foreign Affairs of Germany, then governed by Joschka Fischer, but in the absence of a French and not even an European Union's Envoy, contrary to what was usually practiced on similar occasions in Switzerland (fex. in 1997 at Montreux, in 2000 at Geneva, etc).

Turkey notoriously exploited the failure of the "Annan" Plan in order to convince the EU to decide to start accession Negotiations on December 2004. This provoked an unprecedented series of Institutional Crisis inside the EU, shortly afterwards, when French and Dutch People rejected, 2 popular EuroReferenda by a majority "'No" vote to the EU Constitutional Treaty on 2005, aggraveted in 2004 a Majority Abstention to EU Elections, etc., followed by the recent Irish "No", etc.

"Nabucco" Gas pipeline was notoriously planned since ..2002. It follows an even earlier idea, for an Oil pipeline Baku-Ceyhun, which started to be prepared on 1999-2001 and was meanwhile recently completed.  

So, facts indicate that what is now at stake is based on decisions made during Joschka Fischer's term as former Foreign Minister, closely interested in Turkey's controversial EU-bid.

To the point that he now practically ...switched jobs with a poliician from Turkey, (the State which pays today openly Joschka Fischer), Mr. Ozdemir, who came earlier in Germany, got fast the nationality, and became EiuroMP in a few years, continuing now as head of the "Greens" in Germany, i.e. in Joschka's former job !...

Such astonishing facts risk, unfotunately, to give to German politician Lothar Bisky's criticism of  representative Democracy a topical meaning :

 - "We (EuroLeft Group) think that what is really at stake is Democracy. It's not only about Gas Pipelines or Energy sources", President Lothar Bisky went on to add in his reply to "EuroFora"'s question on Joscka Fischer's personal interests in the controversial Turkish "Nabuco" pipeline.

Such facts, "make People get more distance from Politics. ...People had had enough, and they are fed up !".

- "That's why we (EuroParliament's "EuroLeft" Group) want to strengthen Direct Democracy in Europe. Citizens should be involved in the (EU) Decision-making. In the end of the day, it's not going to help anyone if Politicians are always taking decisions, without involving Citizens. We want to give a voice to the People of Europe. They've got to have their say in the decisions that are taken. That's one of our absolutely fixed and steadfast views. We want more Direct Democracy in Europe. That's how it can become more effective and stronger", he concluded.

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